Tokyowheel CORE Carbon Mountain Bike Wheels

I’d love to get everyone’s feedback on the CORE carbon MTB wheels, and any suggestions or requests that you have for future iterations. If you’re interested in the wheels but something is holding you back from purchasing (hub options, specs, etc.), let me know here and we’ll take your comments into consideration for updates to the product line.

I really appreciate everyone’s feedback, it helps us to serve you better and help you accomplish your cycling goals!

Thanks!

Hi James, looking at the quality and service you provide for 700cc wheels, I honestly believe there is a market for premium quality 29er wheels and it’s hard to find light weight carbon wheels for XC country racing. If you look at DT Swiss XRC wheels then us Europeans have to fork out $2500!

There are many cheaper brands but they don’t perform as well. A lot of fellow cyclists use American Classics and all I hear is pinging/clicking noises. At least 8 cyclists I know have had serious issues with them. I guess there are so many variants to consider, thru bolt rim width ect which makes it more difficult to produce or?

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Very good point!

There is one major reason why currently we don’t offer wheels other than 700c, and we don’t offer track hubs for that matter.

Focus…

We have limited resources of time and manpower.
We are not sure how consumers will responds to a road bike brand extended into a mountain bike brand.

That being said, we are coming up to the point of producing our next generation road, tri, cyclocross wheels. After those are released I think we could experiment with MTB, or maybe even before.

I’d like to get more feedback and judge interest more, so all your comments and feedback are very much appreciated!

I believe mtb rims should be your priority focus. Mountain Bike carbon wheels are fast becoming the upgrade everyone wants. There are to many Chinese companies making exactly the same. If you offer a rim with unique features, you will have Great success.
Great features include hookless bead, anti-burp bead seat. 28mm 350g xc rim. 420g 35mm wide.

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I agree with what you said Craig, you need to open this market. I use too much mountain bike to train in winter and think it is a very large market. I personally use a DT Swiss for what has been said here but I know they are very expensive, if you could do the same at a reasonable price I think would have a lot of sales because people demand carbon wheels for lightness mountain bike and also there are very few reliable brands and then the Chinese are facing many problems.

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I have been contemplating shifting to disc brakes for my CX rig…not sure market size although does cross over with growing movement on road for disc brakes.

Can hit the CX disk and 29r with same couple wheels sets? Although I guess more Axel variations on MTB side of equation.

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@joel, thanks for posting. Great point.

FYI we have a road/ cx disc hubset ready for release soon. It’s 24:24 2x lacing. We will be offering it in 135mm rear. width only at first with 130mm to come soon. With sapim cxray spokes as a +$269.00 upgrade to any of our wheelsets.

What rear spacing is your CX bike?

Good news! My spacing is 135mm

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Thanks for voicing your opinions, we have added Mountain Bike Wheels to our Roadmap. You asked, and we will deliver. Let’s keep discussion specs:

Initially what seems to be a good way to go about things it to offer and CXC™ (Cyclo Cross Country) wheelset. What I mean by this is a 29er tubeless clincher disc wheelset with 3 hub and spoke spoke configurations to suit:

  • Offroad biased disc cyclocross.
  • Cross Country Mountain Bike.
  • Premium Cross Country Mountain Bike

Let us know your feedback and suggestions.

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Hey guys,

As carbon wheels for MTB, I would love persoannly to see both 29" and 27,5".
Ideally, in my eyes, Tubeless is a must.
I’d consider a really hard XC oriented 29" and a 60%downhill/40%uphill (or even 70/30) for AM/Enduro oriented wheelset.
Out of my knowledge, beside Enve, noone is providing Carbon wheels for MTB usage towards serious Trail/Enduro usage… my question is then, why should we only be an aggessive fast XC rider to have access to carbon wheelsets?

In any case, if the choice is offered to go towards MTB, may I suggest to offer an upgrade option regarding the Hubs, and offer a Lefty compatible set…because Premium wheels have to end-up on a Premium bike somehow, haven’t they?

Cheers
Matt

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Carbon composite construction will hold roundness when alloy deforms, and goes out of round or out of true. Carbon is rigid, stronger and longer life. Not just light. It is an essential rim fabrication choice for quality mtb wheel builds, and a natural complement to internal gear hubs for all terrain conditions.

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Hey Matt,
I just read your post and like how you stated that “premium wheels have to end up on a premium bike…” I’m a roadie/runner type so don’t know anything about mountain bikes; so my question is are most MTB thru-axle? I’m considering a new CX bike and 2 of the brands are thru-axle and 1 isn’t. I haven’t ridden any yet so don’t know how much the thru-axle makes a difference on flex. What do you know about the thru-axle versus standard?
AttilaShelton

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Hey Attila,

Thanks for your anwer.
I am not entirely sure that all the bikes are thru axle.
First it depends what type of bike we are considering, i.e. Fully or Hard Tail. On a hard Tail it is quite easy to recognize that the thru axle stiffen up the structure of the bike. since it generates a definitive strong bond.

Regarding the fork, I bet it is the same, but I can not really share my experience on the topic since I’ve mainly been riding Lefty’s so the thru axle is no question…

Then if we consider a Fully, tough to recognize where the stiffness loss is coming from… Many construciton are using seperates bearings for the all connection in the damping chain. Some brands are also using thru axle technologies for the rotation points in the frame.

A global tone, geometrically speaking, a thru axle will always be stiffer than a STD 9mm QR. Then I’d believe that Thru axle may become more and more STD since more and more XC bikes are being designed so.

Hope I answered your question.

cheers

Hi Matt,
Thanks for the reply. It helps me understand a little more about the thru axle. I’ve ridden a Focus cyclocross bike with their R.A.T. thru axle system and found the bike to be quite stiff and very responsive. I’ve got 2 other bikes to test and then I’ll make a decision but I’m sold on the thru axle design.
Thanks again.
Attila

If I were you, I would go with a Thru Axel. We’ve seen a noted difference in just the material of quick release skewers having a big impact on wheel flex. So the logical extension of this improvement would be thru-axels.

We’re releasing 2 new disc hubs, the updated Vapor Disc, we are positioning this as a road disc hubset and offers thru axels, and the DT Swiss 240s DB, which we are recommending for cyclocross is also a 15mm thru axel.

Thanks @James_Ferrer and @Matt_Germany for the replies. Unless the last bike I want to test ride just blows me away I’ll get a thru axle CX bike. The Elite 38s disc brake wheels I bought and glued up for CX last year aren’t thru-axle so I guess the only bad thing is that I’ll have to get a new set of wheels. Is a new set of wheels a bad thing? :confused:

No, I didn’t think so. :grinning:

Sorry, I just realised that my answer was quite evasive… I have to say that I feel a bit confused since this is a Mountain Bike post. and I am not sure we are really talking about MTB wheels/use.

I’m an Enduro/downhill rider in MTB.
Bottom line is that physically speaking, as said a thru axle is necessarily stiffer as long as the structure welcoming it is also stiff.
the arrival of 12/15mm thru axle on the back wheel in the late 90s changed the game in Downhill. a bit later 20mm on the front wheel arrived, and all suddenly the travel of the forks increased to 200/220mm…

As said X-12 on the back wheel is getting bigger and bigger on MTB from XC to more “extrem usage”.

AS a pure aerodynamics stand point, Thru Axle remove the drag from QR lever sticking out… Maybe it could bit a way in a close future… just need to find a fork/frame manufacturer to take on board to make the connection…

cheers

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It’s time to move forwards on MTB wheels. Here are a few topics we’re discussing internally, and I want to open up the discussion to the community.

  1. Mountain Bike Brand.
    We must decide if we will extend the Tokyowheel brand into MTB, or we will create a ‘sister brand’ that is MTB specific. We’ll keep all the great things you like about Tokyowheel the same either way (shipping, price, guarantees, support, community, website style). The big question is does the Mountain Biking community prefer to have a MTB specific brand experiance, or is a cross-over brand more beneficial.

One way to think of the multi-brand approach is how www.gap.com also has Banana Republic, and Old Navy as part of the brand family.

  1. Rim Shape
    We think a 60% uphill, 40% downhill is the best starting point for our MTB product line. The rim shape that we have preliminarily design is hookless anti-burp 32mm wide, 28mm deep (all carbon of course).

What are your thoughts on this.

  1. Wheel Size
    We are planning to offer this in 26" and 29" to start. With 27.5 to follow.

Let me know your feedback on this, and we’ll do our best to fast track some awesome MTB wheels out to you.

Good afternoon James,

I hope you’re doing great since our last conversation. I am just wondering whether you received my last emails since I haven’t got any answer yet. Since MTB is a really interresting topic for me I take advantage of your open questions to step-into the discussion.

  1. Mountain Bike Brand
    I’d believe there would be no clear difference between a Road or MTB dedicated brand versus a global brand. For sure depending of the strength of the brand in one specific segment it would definitely enpower the new-opening-segmentation of the brand. In other words, using the product reputation in one segment to offer credibility to the one opening.

  2. Rim Shape
    I belive this is realitvely personnal topic since it is highly driven by what type of rider people are. I mean, I am a former DH Race I riding Enduro now, so obviously 60/0 would be the wrong ratio for me. On the global scale I would go first for a 50/50 since more and more XC races are very demanding and technical in terms of what has the wheel to undergo. For this I would expand the line of product to a hardcore DH/FreeRide wheel and develop in parallel more Trail, Enduro oriented products.
    I belive that the rim shape is directly related to the purpose of usage. When you say 32mm wide, is it internaly or externaly? I would run a global benchmark first per segment including a couple of high-end Aluminium wheels. Alu !? Yeah, some high end alu wheels are performing a hell of a lot better than average carbon wheels, and if you want to get some market shares, you don’t want to make a carbon poduct worse than aluminium.
    In any case, a solution which is Tubeless is a must.

  3. Wheel Size:
    I personnally don’t see much of a future in the 26". A clear tendence is to remove slowly 26" from the market. Most of the bike developments and new issues are coming in 650B, or 29" when more XC/All mountain oriented. Hence I don’t think that bothering on 26" is worth.

I still have lots of ideas regarding MTB topics should you want to discuss further. My skype remains the same…

cheers

Hey Matt great input. I didn’t get your emails recently give james@tokyowheel.com

Let talk more about this, and your involvement. You and I have discussed the topic of quality control and durability testing (among other things). It seems to me that the most important Key performance indicator of a MTB wheel Is durability. In almost the same way that mass and aero are the key performance indicators for road.

Do you think a significantly more durable and fracture resistant carbon MTB wheel would be welcome by riders?

What are your thoughts?